Help: clarify things before creating Win7 Recovery Discs

Avatar

Please consider registering
Guest

Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

Register Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_topic_old
Help: clarify things before creating Win7 Recovery Discs
Avatar
Flying Dutchman
Member
Forum Posts: 278
Member Since:
September 2, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
March 13, 2011 - 3:56 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Hi guys,

Remember [url=http://www.davescomputertips.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1225:3s6u6ajs]this[/url:3s6u6ajs]? Well, he got a new HP Laptop which came with Win7 Home Premium 64bits preinstalled, no installation CDs/ DVD ( ) and a lot of crapware ( double ). And you guessed right, I'm the fortunate one to take care of everything (good thing my hands are much better).
HP's site & Guide offers no info on this, so here I am.

The machine has a recovery partition (about 15GB), the contents of which I can't access as I only get a HP message not to mess with it. Anyway, the Guide says "HP recommends creating recovery discs to be sure that you can restore your system to its original factory state if you experience serious system failure or instability" - key being "original factory state".
Here's where I could use some help: In case of recovering the system, does "original factory state" include all the crapware (a number of 60 or 30 days trials like Norton IS, MS Office 2007, Norton Online Backup), MS Live & IE, Adobe Reader, outdated version of Java & Flash and on top of everything, that WildTangent Console thingy) I intend to get rid of?

Needless to say that I'd prefer the Recovery Disks not to include it, so I was thinking of making them after getting rid of this stuff, but that term makes me doubt it's going to happen - I just noticed that the recovery partition has a part called "preloaded", doesn't sound good.
Am I correct? Is there a way to exclude all this stuff and make "clean" Recovery Disks?

Second question: I'm going to create another partition for his data and maybe one for portable apps. In case of a recovery, will these partitions be affected (i.e. get lost)?

Before anyone says "Imaging", that's the route we're taking, but I want to cover the "Recovery" chapter as well.

Thanks ahead.

P.S. It looks like I'm going to spend quite some time in this subforum, making use of your tips, Ozbloke, so thanks for your effort.

I am human

Avatar
grr
Member
Forum Posts: 211
Member Since:
April 26, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
March 13, 2011 - 4:58 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

[quote:x2qyoscj]The machine has a recovery partition (about 15GB), the contents of which I can't access as I only get a HP message not to mess with it. Anyway, the Guide says "HP recommends creating recovery discs to be sure that you can restore your system to its original factory state if you experience serious system failure or instability" - key being "original factory state".[/quote:x2qyoscj]

Recovery partition = = Recovery Disks. However I would suggest creating Recovery DVDs from Windows. (requires 3 DVDs)

[quote:x2qyoscj]Here's where I could use some help: In case of recovering the system, does "original factory state" include all the crapware (a number of 60 or 30 days trials like Norton IS, MS Office 2007, Norton Online Backup), MS Live & IE, Adobe Reader, outdated version of Java & Flash and on top of everything, that WildTangent Console thingy) I intend to get rid of? [/quote:x2qyoscj]

Yes...everything to original factory. Better do remove the crap, and then create a System Image from Windows.

[quote:x2qyoscj]Needless to say that I'd prefer the Recovery Disks not to include it, so I was thinking of making them after getting rid of this stuff, but that term makes me doubt it's going to happen - I just noticed that the recovery partition has a part called "preloaded", doesn't sound good.
Am I correct? Is there a way to exclude all this stuff and make "clean" Recovery Disks?[/quote:x2qyoscj]

No, as far as I understand & am aware of. Reason these disks would just help repair the Windows.

[quote:x2qyoscj]Second question: I'm going to create another partition for his data and maybe one for portable apps. In case of a recovery, will these partitions be affected (i.e. get lost)?[/quote:x2qyoscj]

Yes
Just create a System Image from Windows once u have created ur partitions. In case of any mishap u could revert back 2 this image.

Thanks,
Grr

Avatar
Jim Hillier
Admin
Forum Posts: 2492
Member Since:
August 9, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
March 13, 2011 - 5:20 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Hey FD - So pleased to hear your hands are better than they were.

[quote:3x8jsvih]does "original factory state" include all the crapware[/quote:3x8jsvih]
Yes, it does. Restoring/recovering to original factory state will include all "value added software" (HP speak for Crapware )

HP offers the creation of recovery discs to overcome hard drive failure. Under normal circumstances the recovery partition would be the best route but, of course, if the hard drive fails the recovery partition would no longer be available......then you would need to use the recovery discs to recover to a new hard drive.

[quote:3x8jsvih]Am I correct? Is there a way to exclude all this stuff and make "clean" Recovery Disks?[/quote:3x8jsvih]
No, there is no way to do that. The recovery discs are created from the recovery partition which will always include all the pre-installed bloatware.

[quote:3x8jsvih]I'm going to create another partition for his data and maybe one for portable apps. In case of a recovery, will these partitions be affected[/quote:3x8jsvih]
Not 100% certain on this one FD. Seeing how the recovery process starts off with a complete re-format, logic dictates that the most likely answer would be yes....you will probably lose that data. Dave or Zig may know for sure.

[b:3x8jsvih]Suggestion[/b:3x8jsvih]: Why not download the relevant Windows 7 iso and burn your own installation disc? You would then always have that on hand for a clean install. Doesn't matter if it is not the original disc; all you need is any disc containing the exact same Windows 7 edition as the original plus your product key. That, together with imaging, would cover all eventualities.

Windows 7 iso files can be download [url=http://www.mydigitallife.info/2010/04/28/download-windows-7-iso-official-32-bit-and-64-bit-direct-download-links/:3x8jsvih]HERE.[/url:3x8jsvih]
[i:3x8jsvih](I used one of these ISO's to install Windows 7, no problems. They would not, of course, include SP1)[/i:3x8jsvih]

Cheers.....Jim

UPDATE:

Grr - Ooops, sorry mate!! We must have been answering at the exact same time. Your post wasn't there when I started and I only saw it after 'submitting' my own.

Avatar
Flying Dutchman
Member
Forum Posts: 278
Member Since:
September 2, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
4
March 13, 2011 - 6:33 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Thanks for the replies, guys.

Not to happy to get all my fears & suspicions confirmed. Don't you just hate what companies do? The so called "value added software" is only there to lure you into cashing out more of your hard earned money (hm, reminds me of another thread here).

@Jim
I was more concerned about the partitions than the data (that's what backup is for). Anyway, no big deal.

I've already thought of making my own installation disks (thanks for a very well known & bookmarked link); only concern is that I've read (social.technet.microsoft.com Forums) that it doesn't work on branded machines that come with preinstalled Windows, due to possible customizations done to Windows 7 OEM

I am human

Avatar
Jim Hillier
Admin
Forum Posts: 2492
Member Since:
August 9, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
March 13, 2011 - 7:14 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

[quote:o9etsm5u]I was more concerned about the partitions than the data (that's what backup is for).[/quote:o9etsm5u]
Yes, sorry for not being clearer FD. That is the part (whether or not the created partitions would be retained) I am unsure of. The partitions and any data therein are intrinsically connected, whatever happens to one is going to happen to both. My[i:o9etsm5u] guess[/i:o9etsm5u] is that the partitions would disappear along with the data. Hope that helps clarify.

[quote:o9etsm5u]I've read (social.technet.microsoft.com Forums) that it doesn't work on branded machines that come with preinstalled Windows, due to possible customizations done to Windows 7 OEM

Avatar
Flying Dutchman
Member
Forum Posts: 278
Member Since:
September 2, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
6
March 13, 2011 - 8:35 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Hmmm, unless of course...the actual product key number has restrictions/stipulations associated with it; knowing HP, that is quite likely!!

Cheers.....Jim[/quote:1ky8g35d][/quote:1ky8g35d]
That's encouraging!
Now, if I only knew where to get a full list of those HP restrictions/stipulations
Why does it feel like, along with your OS + other paid S/W, you don't really own your machine either?

I am human

Avatar
Jim Hillier
Admin
Forum Posts: 2492
Member Since:
August 9, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
7
March 13, 2011 - 8:56 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Well, it is a possibility FD.
[quote:1f2jwlhj]Why does it feel like, along with your OS + other paid S/W, you don't really own your machine either?[/quote:1f2jwlhj] Here, here!!

I don't quite understand your concern over the recovery situation FD . Would not creating images using both Windows 7 (native software) and something like Macrium Reflect cover it pretty well??

Cheers....Jim

Avatar
Flying Dutchman
Member
Forum Posts: 278
Member Since:
September 2, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
8
March 13, 2011 - 9:37 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

[quote:3anfslrm]I don't quite understand your concern over the recovery situation FD .[/quote:3anfslrm]
Well, after all the talking about it, I'm starting to wonder about it myself .

Jokes aside, I guess you're right, I need to give it a rest.
I'll just do my usual routine (get rid of crapware, install useful stuff & an Image), and see about the rest later.

Thanks again for all the help.

I am human

Avatar
Jim Hillier
Admin
Forum Posts: 2492
Member Since:
August 9, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
March 13, 2011 - 10:38 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

FD - Here is a link to an article written by our very own Dave which will guide you through the steps to re-install Windows without the need to activate again. The guide relates to Vista but the same applies exactly for Windows 7.

This will overcome the possibility that any restrictions have been placed on the product key:

https://davescomputertips.com/articl ... vation.php

Cheers....Jim

Avatar
grr
Member
Forum Posts: 211
Member Since:
April 26, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
March 14, 2011 - 7:12 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

@Jim - that's ok, might be some problem.

@FD- I also bought a new Sony Vaio and had the same problem. Before making any changes to the new laptop, I did the following:

1. Created System Repair Disk - 1 CD
2. Created Recovery Disks - 3 DVDs
3. Took an image of the complete laptop, usually 25-30Gb space. This will have all the partitions.

Then i removed all the crap-ware -like MS office starter, Norton and few others. Now created another image to fall back in case of any failure.

Few points:

The recovery disks would help complete restore of ur system back 2 working, without any need of activation. However it would be restored to factory default.

The recovery partition does the same work as the recovery disks.

Thanks,
Grr

Avatar
Chad Johnson
Mod
Forum Posts: 867
Member Since:
August 11, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11
March 14, 2011 - 8:50 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Wow, take a weekend off and....

well anyway.

Two things I would offer to you FD:
There should be a sticker stuck to the machine or in your documentation that contains your Windows Key. Very Likely it's OEM, which means it will really only run on the machine it came with. Not an issue for recovery purposes, but it means you can't transfer Windows to another machine. Follow this [url=http://pcsupport.about.com/od/productkeysactivation/ht/windows-7-key.htm:11ppl9yw]guide[/url:11ppl9yw] to compare the sticker to the installed Product Key.

Usually the OEM discs and recovery partitions contain all the drivers you need and make reinstalling dead simple (though, crapware full). A good driver backup utility works wonders. I haven't used one in awhile, so if you want one maybe someone can recommend one. I'd have to search to find the one I used to use.

2 - Downloading the ISO is key to any recovery scenario. The recovery disks HP lets you make don't offer any kind of troubleshooting tools (Recovery Console, etc).

--Zig

Avatar
grr
Member
Forum Posts: 211
Member Since:
April 26, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12
March 14, 2011 - 9:44 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

The drivers would be available for free from HP site. I got mine from Sony site & d/l to HD.

Avatar
Chad Johnson
Mod
Forum Posts: 867
Member Since:
August 11, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13
March 14, 2011 - 12:42 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

The drivers would be available for free from HP site. I got mine from Sony site & d/l to HD.[/quote:31czq0b7]

No doubt that they are, but it's sometimes easier to pull the drivers you know work off of a current install than to search through gobs of webpages for drivers you hope will work.

Avatar
grr
Member
Forum Posts: 211
Member Since:
April 26, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
14
March 14, 2011 - 4:31 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

The drivers would be available for free from HP site. I got mine from Sony site & d/l to HD.[/quote:33j6ysa8]

No doubt that they are, but it's sometimes easier to pull the drivers you know work off of a current install than to search through gobs of webpages for drivers you hope will work.[/quote:33j6ysa8]

Yeh, that's right. But as the laptop is new the HP site should list all the drivers on a single page. The Sony site does that and even allows downloading all the drivers together as a Basket.

Avatar
Flying Dutchman
Member
Forum Posts: 278
Member Since:
September 2, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15
March 14, 2011 - 5:55 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Guys, thanks for the extra input.

@grr
Nice order of things to do, will keep it in mind.
Yes, HP has all the drivers listed; I haven't yet checked if there're updates to any of them, but I'd rather do a backup, since, as Ziggie said, the installed ones work.

@Ziggie
1. I suspected that the HP Recovery Disks would be of no use for troubleshooting, thanks for the confirmation.
2. Yes, there's a sticker stuck to the bottom of the machine with the Windows Key - that was the first thing I checked when I found out that there's no installation DVD. Thanks for the link, will try that.
3. I don't want to transfer Windows to another machine, my friend just got it brand new and I was the first one to turn it on.
4. Thanks for reminding me to back up the drivers - I hate searching for them, even on manufacturers' sites. I'm a happy user of Double Driver which should work on Win 7 64bits, but I'm open to other suggestions.

@Jim
That link to Dave's guide just made my day . Was planning on checking out the main site today, but I'd probably miss the article as it's under Vista - have to make a sticky to myself to remember to check out Vista things on Win 7.

Things are looking much brighter, too bad I have to postpone the process for a few days, due to work.

Once again, thank you all, you've been of great help.

I am human

Forum Timezone: America/Indiana/Indianapolis

Most Users Ever Online: 188

Currently Online:
6 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 10

Members: 1273

Moderators: 3

Admins: 4

Forum Stats:

Groups: 8

Forums: 19

Topics: 1538

Posts: 11824

Administrators: Jim Hillier, Richard Pedersen, David Hartsock, Marc Thomas

Moderators: Judy Novotny, Jason Shuffield, Mail Poet