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Backup and Media Servers
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David Hartsock
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July 12, 2010 - 12:48 am
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[quote="Green Lantern":31bhiuao]So if I wanted to compromise, I could go shopping for a box with plenty of expansion slots for additional HDs, make sure it had a "gigabit network" card built into it or buy one for it, install WHS server and I'd be in business?[/quote:31bhiuao]
Yes. BUT... There's always a "but". It is important for any hardware to support Server 2003 for the current WHS and/or Server 2008 for Vail. WHS is built upon those OS's so any drivers would need to be for them. WHS would install generic drivers and it would work, but having a specific driver would be preferred. [quote:31bhiuao]It would probably cost about half of what HP would be asking for their teeny media vault and I could always add new components or replace old ones. With the HP box, I think that would be fairly difficult as it's so small.[/quote:31bhiuao]
There would be a savings, but to what degree I can't answer. It would depend on what components you choose, how many drivers, and which HP server you bought.
[quote:31bhiuao]I'm thinking of downloading the beta version of Vail and using that for the moment. The only issue there is I'm wondering if after the beta I would be able to upgrade to the production version without having to reinstall everything and renter all the parameters.[/quote:31bhiuao]
I don't believe you will be able to "upgrade", as least you couldn't with the current version. At the least you could remove all the data drives, upgrade, copy the files to the server, then install the empty drive (WHS will format the drive when you add it to the pool).

If you just want to give the Vail beta a try go ahead! It won't hurt anything.

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David Hartsock
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July 12, 2010 - 12:59 am
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[quote="Green Lantern":2r51rbfn]The new software for WHS will be 64 bit. I'm wondering what that means compared to the current situation. Currently the console, as I understand it, is installed on a client. It is 32 bit software. If the WHS has 64 bit processors would any tasks such as streaming or backups be processed using all 64 bits or would everything including the server run in 32 bit mode? I'm asking because if it only the client that is running in 32 bit mode it wouldn't really impact the performance greatly if all it does is start and stop tasks running in 64 bit mode.[/quote:2r51rbfn]

The Vail software is 64bit, meaning it will need to be installed on systems that support 64bit processes - A computer with a 64bit CPU. As with 64bit versions of Windows, which can (and do) allow 32bit programs to run, the core OS and subsystems will be 64bit on the server. It will be able to run 32bit programs if there is a cool program you just have to have.
-Server software and subsystems will be 64bit.
-If you choose to add a program that is 32bit the server will chug along happily.

The client software is matched to the version of Windows you are running on the client. If you run Windows in a 32bit flavor a 32bit compatible connector will be installed. Likewise, if you are running a 64bit flavor of Windows a 64bit compatible connector will be installed.

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Green Lantern
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July 12, 2010 - 5:08 am
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Dave wrote:

It really isn't that difficult or costly, especially in a single story home. 300 ft of cat5e cable can be had for $50 or less. Put the internet modem, router, and WHS in a closet. Drill a hole in the ceiling to run Ethernet cables. Have a look where you would like to have wired connections (entertainment center, office or den, computer locations) and note were the electric outlets are. Wires to the outlets will most likely be through the attic. Find the wire drop for the area needed and move one direction or the other 16 inches. Drill a hole - drop a cable. Cut a hole in the drywall and fish it out. A lot less complicated than it sounds, but easier with two people.

Hi Dave

As always thanks for your valuable advice. I live in a two story home with 8 inch thick concrete block walls and ceilings. Trust me, putting in a wired network after the fact would not be easy.

GL

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Green Lantern
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July 12, 2010 - 5:12 am
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Dave wrote:

The Vail software is 64bit, meaning it will need to be installed on systems that support 64bit processes - A computer with a 64bit CPU. As with 64bit versions of Windows, which can (and do) allow 32bit programs to run, the core OS and subsystems will be 64bit on the server. It will be able to run 32bit programs if there is a cool program you just have to have.
-Server software and subsystems will be 64bit.
-If you choose to add a program that is 32bit the server will chug along happily.

The client software is matched to the version of Windows you are running on the client. If you run Windows in a 32bit flavor a 32bit compatible connector will be installed. Likewise, if you are running a 64bit flavor of Windows a 64bit compatible connector will be installed.

Hi Dave

This is where I get confused: I watched an installation of an HP WHS on YouTube yesterday. The HP has no CD/DVD drive. The installation of the server was all done from the client console. I assumed there was nothing on the HP server, which in retrospect is stupid. There would have to be some kind of OS and as you point out with the current version it is Windows Server 2003. Either it is preinstalled on the HP box or it gets installed from the console during the installation procedure.

GL

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Green Lantern
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July 12, 2010 - 5:18 am
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Dave wrote:

There are quite a few "ifs" and buts" in networking. The faster wireless connection will be a Wireless "N" router using MIMO (multi in multi out). The cards in your computers would also have to be Wireless "N" and MIMO. Dual band (2.4Ghz/5.8Ghz) cards/router would be preferable, so look for a dual band wireless N router with MIMO. This will yield transfer speeds maxing out around 5MBs give or take.

Hi Dave

There you go. I had NO idea that the fastest wireless was THAT much slower than a wired connection. That's wild. Now I can see why you like wired so much! But as I mentioned in an earlier post, it would be a major deal to put a wired network in. What I might be able to do is to get one of those systems that use the house's electrical wiring system for networking. That might be a viable option. But our outlets are already so overburdened with all our devices that I would probably have to hire an electrician to elaborate it.

As far as stability goes, we haven't had huge problems with wireless and we've had it now for years. That wouldn't be my main concern. If there's a blip there's a blip. We're not the European Space Agency here.

Best

GL

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Green Lantern
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July 12, 2010 - 5:26 am
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Hi Dave

In your earlier post you noted that the fastest wireless networks today would yield a transfer speed of about 5 Mbps. I was shocked to hear that. I looked at a few ads for routers and here is an example of one of many I found:

TRENDnet Wireless N Home Router (TEW-632BRP)

* Retails for: $35 (one of the lowest prices you'll ever see!)
* Features:[b:19qsk827] Transfer speeds of up to 300Mbps[/b:19qsk827], four times the range of a standard Wireless G router (can roughtly estimate to about 1200 feet); compatible with PC and Mac
* Warranty: 1 year Parts and Labour

There's quite some difference between 5 Mbps and 300. What am I not getting here?

GL

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David Hartsock
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July 12, 2010 - 6:32 am
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[quote="Green Lantern":km77src5] I watched an installation of an HP WHS on YouTube yesterday. The HP has no CD/DVD drive. The installation of the server was all done from the client console. I assumed there was nothing on the HP server, which in retrospect is stupid. There would have to be some kind of OS and as you point out with the current version it is Windows Server 2003. Either it is preinstalled on the HP box or it gets installed from the console during the installation procedure.[/quote:km77src5]
The OS is preinstalled on the HP servers. You receive a CD with the connector software, which you install on a client PC. You then configure the server through the console software on the client computer.

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David Hartsock
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July 12, 2010 - 6:35 am
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[quote="Green Lantern":3u5dcypl]I had NO idea that the fastest wireless was THAT much slower than a wired connection. That's wild. Now I can see why you like wired so much! But as I mentioned in an earlier post, it would be a major deal to put a wired network in. What I might be able to do is to get one of those systems that use the house's electrical wiring system for networking. That might be a viable option. But our outlets are already so overburdened with all our devices that I would probably have to hire an electrician to elaborate it.

As far as stability goes, we haven't had huge problems with wireless and we've had it now for years. That wouldn't be my main concern. If there's a blip there's a blip. We're not the European Space Agency here.[/quote:3u5dcypl]
There are creative ways to do it also. Under carpet. Along baseboards. Use your imagination.

Problems aren't very noticeable, but when you are watching a 5GB movie and it stutters or stops to buffer content you start to notice.

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David Hartsock
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July 12, 2010 - 6:46 am
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[quote="Green Lantern":zjn451mb]In your earlier post you noted that the fastest wireless networks today would yield a transfer speed of about 5 Mbps.[/quote:zjn451mb]
I said 5MBs as in Bytes. 8 bits = 1byte. B=bytes b=bits. My stated 5MBs would equal 40Mbps.

[quote:zjn451mb]I looked at a few ads for routers and here is an example of one of many I found:
TRENDnet Wireless N Home Router (TEW-632BRP)
* Retails for: $35 (one of the lowest prices you'll ever see!)
* Features:[b:zjn451mb] Transfer speeds of up to 300Mbps[/b:zjn451mb], four times the range of a standard Wireless G router (can roughtly estimate to about 1200 feet);
There's quite some difference between 5 Mbps and 300. What am I not getting here?[/quote:zjn451mb]
300Mbps would equal 37MBs. The chances of you seeing that speed using that device are about the same as a gnat piloting the next space shuttle mission!

Those specs are "perfect world" results from their test lab and you won't see those. 37MB transfer speeds? Not likely. 1200ft distances? Only with special high gain antennas and perfect line of sight. Your expectation of wireless transfer speeds should be 5MB to 10MB tops. There are just too many environmental factors in the real world that can/will affect a signal with such a high frequency and low power output.

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Green Lantern
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July 12, 2010 - 6:58 am
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Thanks Dave

I didn't realize you meant MBytes. Yes, I know, overhead. Since I posted I checked out a system from Devolo. http://www.devolo.co.uk/consumer/70_dla ... .html?l=en.

I works through the electrical wiring and should have speeds well over 100 Mbps. The maximum, probably also unobtainable, is 200 Mbps.

Thanks for all your help!

GL

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David Hartsock
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July 12, 2010 - 7:07 am
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